Donk’d off/Cold Deck’d on FT

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    • #26332
      Karan M

      Poker Stars $2.00+$0.20 No Limit Hold’em Tournament – t90000/t180000 Blinds + t18000 – 9 players – View hand 1987611
      DeucesCracked Poker Videos Hand History Converter

      MP1: t8658891 M = 20.04
      MP2: t308676 M = 0.71
      CO: t1717113 M = 3.97
      BTN: t891198 M = 2.06
      SB: t3259860 M = 7.55
      BB: t2221347 M = 5.14
      UTG: t5325056 M = 12.33
      Hero (UTG+1): t2431275 M = 5.63
      UTG+2: t1980584 M = 4.58

      Pre Flop: (t432000) Hero is UTG+1 with K :club: A :diamond:
      , Hero raises to t540000, , MP1 raises to t8640891 all in, , Hero calls t1873275 all in

      Flop: (t5258550) A :spade: 6 :spade: 4 :heart: (2 players – 2 are all in)

      Turn: (t5258550) T :spade: (2 players – 2 are all in)

      River: (t5258550) 9 :heart: (2 players – 2 are all in)

      On FT, was card dead the two orbits I was in and ended up playing my first and last hand. CL was active as is the case with CLs. First was 3500 an MTT win eludes me again. There is a saying in telugu, this guy crosses all seven seas to reach home but slips in a drainage hole in front of his home and dies. I feel like that guy. Played the tourney well, was like 1/20 with a good CL but just tightened up myself to knock around on FT so ended up reaching like 3/4 into FT. BTW this was 2x-turbo. Maybe I could have waited but on a shove well I am just hoping he is not holding AA/KK.

      Edit: He did have AA. Also at these low buyin games I make it a point not to look at payout structure so that it doesnt impact my play. Well this was detrimental, maybe I would have folded 🙂

    • #34965

      Look I really don’t want to sound condescending but this is very ironic.

      You can ignore me if you like, but I really recommend that for a change, think about your game and start with the possibility that your approach might be wrong. The reason this is happening to you, is that you are tightening up too much and you inevitably don’t have huge stacks at the end unless you get very very good cards. If you think you can win 2x turbos by tightening up, you are simply wrong, again I am not trying to be unpleasant, but this is simply a fact. You just have to get it in, even in marginal spots, because you don’t have a huge edge, and you won’t find “better spots”.

      The fact that you are even thinking of folding AK here, or thinking this might be donkish, shows that you are playing waaaay too tight. Even in your bad beat thread where your kings got sucked out on, you wanted to just take down the pot rather than maximize value because a lot of money was at stake. Unless you play aggressively and take these risks, the big wins will continue to elude you.

      It’s not a coincidence that you probably keep wondering how all those donkeys who put their chips in with weak hands keep getting huge stacks and winning tourneys. The reality is, in many cases, these guys are not donkeys and putting it in with those weak hands is mathematically correct. At the minimum I would recommend that if you don’t want to learn optimal short-stack play and the mathematics behind going all-in at late stages, you should refrain from playing turbos and instead play standard speed tourneys.

    • #34967

      Join PGMP. Period. 🙂

      btw, fwiw, the hand plays itself. you just got unlucky.

    • #34968
      Karan M

      The last conversation went wild at some point and happy to have the dust settled. As I said comments are absolutely and always welcome. I totally agree with all that you have identified in this reply. I know you didnt mean it to be condescending but I got to give it to you man 🙂 Do you think I reached FT of a 2x-turbo 2600+ minefield by just playing tight? I said I tightened up 1/20, didnt say I played the tourney tight 🙂

      As for tightening up with CL with 20 players left, I had to do that because of the following reasons that were swimming in my head:
      1. Its a 2x turbo and I would make FT with a good stack pretty soon (made it 3/4 in 9 to FT)
      2. Have a good stack, I am confident my FT play would keep me ahead of the pack.
      3. I have been falling short of FTs in the past couple of days exactly because of playing with marginal edges. I didnt want to slip up this time with a big stack in hand so let the others fallout than me.
      4. I wanted to get a score behind first so prolly didnt have the cojones to go out firing with a fair possibility of not making FT (this has happened in the last couple of days).
      5. There were a couple of active players to my left with stacks that could cripple me so just sat back to make it to FT.

      As for the last para in your reply, I have been playing live/online since 2005 (never FT) so that kinda thinking is way behind me. I am not a noob to think oh that donk won that or this. If one doesnt have the necessary results to show doesnt mean the player doesnt have the needed understanding to play the game. Of course theory and practicals are way different particularly online. Yes, my online game needs to be a lot refined. As for calling it donkish, bankroll wise it was totally donkish, play wise it was ok not optimal because except for Ax/Kx hands I am flipping for my tourney life, I just ran into a cold deck – as simple as that. Here I am trying for a decent win and knowing you have an edge on atleast 60% of the table, I could have folded. After fact it is just analysis, I did end up calling as I always do! Just put in my remarks with the hand and my thoughts in first post. 9th was 200+ and first was 3500, for someone trying to make a score first it really hit me in the gut to have busted out like that. Well I am not saying my AK call was bad, folding wasnt that bad there given the other factors. Well I will hope to make something happen cant be getting this near and not close it out. Again, hopefully I will run better…….

    • #34969
      Karan M

      I tried, didnt make it!

      Join PGMP. Period. 🙂

      btw, fwiw, the hand plays itself. you just got unlucky.

    • #34970

      If you think you can win 2x turbos

      If you got that far playing good aggro poker, why don’t you play your best when it matters the most? Also, believe me I have seen people reach late stages of 10,000 man turbos playing very tight, its quite normal if you are a regular player. Some days you will get lots of big hands and go deep.

      Again I don’t want to argue, but none of those reasons you listed for tightening up are correct or good in the long run. Money in the MTTs come from BIG scores (top 3 and above) you are never going to make it that deep without taking risks in a turbo.

      I am not trying to hate on you, but its just a fact that you (and to be honest not even the best in the world) don’t EVER have a big enough edge to justify folding AK with 15 BBs preflop.

      It absolutely is optimal to get it in with AK, because AK beats their ranges by a distance. This is just basic equity calculation which can be done through pokerstove.

      If this keeps happening to you, think about what I am telling you, you have to run VERY good to win an online turbo if you are going to play tight at the later stages.

    • #26333
      Karan M

      I totally agree with what you said and are reiterating. I just wanted to get the MTT win(or top 3) monkey off my back. I did a gear change with the other factors in mind. Yes I could have kept playing as I was, just went with the safety first approach. Banking a good win does wonders to a player’s psyche or atleast for me. I will keep in mind that points you have identified and thanks for the advice.

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