please explain this play – killing me and can’t understand

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    • #24517
      Sujith Raj

      early position – EP
      middle position – MP
      Late position – LP

      have seen this happen and have experienced below mentioned play a lot and i’m usually the EP.
      happens close to the bubble or ITM

      EP has say XX(any pair),AK/AQ —-> EP raises 3-5x the bb
      MP with AK,AQ,AJ,AT —–> goes all in
      LP with Ax – x stands for 2-7 – —> calls or reraises all in

      1) why would LP raise so much with Ax considering there has been a raise and reraise infront of him, and atleast one guy has AT or better , rt ? or is he thinking. mama mia, they have a pair of ducks and crabs let me hit my obvious three outer and triple up ??

      please explain to me LP’s play.

      2) happens a lot during late stages – EP/MP guy goes all in and LP with Ax (x = 2-8) calls or goes all in.
      what is LP doing here? why isn’t he putting EP/MP guys on a decent pair or higher AX than him ?


      my undestanding must be flawed somewhere :(.

      senior tourney guys help me out here please.

    • #31075

      Simply put, Ax = The Nuts :p

    • #31077
      Sujith Raj

      have seen u do it too bomber, usually one of ur double up hands :).

      there was this other tourney – final table with 5-6players or last 12-13 players, table had only 5-6 players, dont remember whether it was donka or samohhh (player id) i was railing.

      same thing again. 77 vs A5 (a girlie, id was feminine) vs AK

      A5 – will lose 1/2 of her chips if lost against AK , 77 guy had 1/3rd of her chips.

      LP 77 all in, AK all in button or sb, A5 allin sb/bb
      there was a 7 and 5 on the flop – AK went out, A5 evened out or munched a small profit.

      interesting part is after going out AK guy wrote in rail – haha A5 , and she replied – do u expect me to fold A5 there?. I was speculating y not fold. checked her (A5’s) OPR, my O my , she is ranked below thousand for atleast the last 2 years and have been doing well from 2007. (currently going thru last few tournies of bomber and samohhh ,to trace her id, in which they placed below 15)

      again, thts what, good top ranked players are doing so and that too so late in tourney where 1 position jump in money is so juicy.

      makes me wonder…. bomber, makes me wonder……

    • #31081

      In a nutshell, what u describe happens more in the mid-high stakes MTTS because many players play a lot more aggressively esp when short stacked. Players often tend to shove light hence get called and shoved over by what you might perceive to be marginal hands. However, in general a 3rd person calling after a shove and a reshove with Ax happens very rarely where either the guy is a fish or there”s some sick player dynamics going on.

    • #31082

      Exactly like Sushi said, it depends heavily on table dynamics and what kinda tourney it is. In turbos, the shoving ranges are really wide and your ISO ing range is wide too. ( again depends on stack sizes, position and reads). However, for an EP shove, and Mp reshove, I think i am folding a lotta decent aces, Pairs and stuff in that spot. And the 3.5 – 5x utg is kinda weird. I dunno. If you can find the HH it would be nice as we can explain any other dynamics involved in the decision.

    • #31084
      Sujith Raj

      thanks a lot guys.

      samohhh u got the monkey off my back, i was folding(depending on blinds left and position) 22 thru 77s and lot of Axs in that spot and was thinking i have a major flaw being gun shy. HH – got none, thought, to post HH every time i found something i can’t understand will be bugging u guys. HH wud have been great, and yea a lot depends on player/betting dynamics.

      I’m following you beautiful players closely and everyday learning bit here bit there when it reaches show down and can see ur hole cards (but shucks, rarely reaches showdown).

      loved the 4bet-5bet 89diamonds KO’ing the bullets sicko, you know who im talking to 🙂 , wowziee !!

      you min raised (MP) and SB – 3bet (2.5x) – so u might be thinking – u min raised so he thinks u have say a mid-decent pair /QK/Ax type of hand and with his bullets he 3bets inviting u in – now u know u min raised and he has seen it , being a min raise, he 3 bets u – now u put him on mid-decent pair/AK/AQ/AJ/AT- now u 4 bet him making him think , NO the initial min raise was with a strong hand indeed – pressure is back ON !
      but he 5 bets u and u called (he definitely has AA/KK,rt ? AK he wud have shoved).
      u hit top pair and called the bet(he bet, but a call-able amount – poor fella) and the turn – HERO looks at his tray of OREOS, want a cookie??.

      awesome hand man !!

    • #31087

      hahaha yea dat hand was awesome..i’ve played with him before too so some history between us. Yea well lot of factors went into it, stack sizes, dynamics, the fact that I’d been active. And yea after his 5b, I knew he had aces and I got invited in cause we still had a lot behind. Again, he bet so small on the flop so I was happy to call and after that, yea he was history hehe 😀

    • #31089
      Sujith Raj

      well deserved one bro. we take insane beats day in day out, so hands like these keep sanity at bay 🙂

    • #31097
      Sujith Raj

      one doubt guys:

      yesterday was horrendous and i restricted the number of tournies and sngs, came back today – tournies still OMG, SNGs(18 man, NL hi/lo) if i don’t consider 2 top 2 finishes it has been real bad too…. lots of coolers, 1-4 outers, running into AA-lows when pushed against etc.

      so, when you feel you are on a downswing – how to cope with it?
      1) dont play for 2-3 days hope it goes away ?
      2) play, play, play get through it ?

      i’m not tilting or spewing chips away. playing good, but feel like hit a road bump.

    • #31099

      Well taking a break always helps me get back my confidence after a downswing. Better to take rest, clear the head and come back strong after a couple of days then be bogged down.

    • #24518
      Sujith Raj

      true it does help to stay away for some time and realise variance is part of the game and just have to live through it. it stops when it stops and nothing we can do about it i guess.

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