rivered 2 pair.. call or shove ..

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    • #25736

      Poker Stars $5.00+$0.50 No Limit Hold’em Tournament – t800/t1600 Blinds + t150 – 8 players
      DeucesCracked Poker Videos Hand History Converter

      nokep-cTap (UTG+1): t103795 M = 28.83
      Sura8459 (MP1): t92434 M = 25.68
      Hero (MP2): t70001 M = 19.44
      manwinoname (CO): t49989 M = 13.89
      kancha_01 (BTN): t25383 M = 7.05
      ANIMATOR777 (SB): t30852 M = 8.57
      ThWitzi (BB): t21227 M = 5.90
      nielsmill (UTG): t17753 M = 4.93

      Pre Flop: (t3600) Hero is MP2 with 5 :spade: 7 :spade:
      , Hero raises to t3200, , ANIMATOR777 calls t2400,

      Flop: (t9200) 7 :club: T :club: 3 :spade: (2 players)
      ANIMATOR777 checks, Hero checks

      Turn: (t9200) A :spade: (2 players)
      ANIMATOR777 bets t4800, Hero calls t4800

      River: (t18800) 5 :diamond: (2 players)
      ANIMATOR777 bets t6400, Hero

    • #33493

      You raise to get value from ace pair hand. So lets analyze which Ax hand would have played the hand this way. AQ/AK would have 3-bet i guess. AJ/AT would have flatted. some combos of Axss might have flatted too but hard to see them bet turn and river both with a weak kicker. A9ss,A8ss,A4ss would check call the river rather than bet .
      So, AJ is the only had that could have played this way and might call your river raise. All other hands that call your raise will have you beat.

      Hence, just a call imo!

    • #33497
      Arjun Parmar
      Member

      fold pre… 🙂

    • #33499

      LOL @ Fold pre. Unreg pre >>>>> fold pre. Not raising this would be terrible.

      Shove now.

      No idea where you came up with all these assumptions in a $5 tourney Jagdeep, mostly they are flat out wrong.

    • #33500

      i would have folded pre…now that you have called and got the 2 pair imo you should shove…he probably has one pair

    • #33502

      LOL @ Fold pre. Unreg pre >>>>> fold pre.

      lmaoooo….. sorry arjun bhai.. but its funny..

    • #33504

      LOL @ Fold pre. Unreg pre >>>>> fold pre.

      Gold!

      Cbet that flop for value. everything else seems fine.


      @arjun
      – with shallow stacks (25Bb or less, maybe 30BB even), its right to fold pre. But when we are sitting so deep, its fine to open trash, as long as you can play them postflop, pot control often being the key. And btw, 57s is borderline trash ;P ..

    • #33514

      Shove now.

      Cant see the reasoning behind the shove… what worse hands are calling your shove anyways?

    • #33516
      richestuser
      Member

      yup shove here…opponent is betting 6400 in pot of 18800…thats too weak….
      opponent is putting u on AJ and over….so opponent might get bluffed out with shove and at same time if he calls( because of his short stack)..u have something which can be good

    • #33517

      Jagdeep- Lots of aces. Read what I wrote about your assumptions. Just because you wouldn’t play a hand in a certain way doesn’t mean morons in $5 tourneys will play the exact same way. If you think anyone in a $5 tourney has the discipline to fold AQ/AK/AJ or any ace for that matter, you need to play a lot more of these.

    • #33518

      C-bet yo… I would shove river…

    • #33521

      result: I shoved .. Villain tank-called with A3 for better 2P..

    • #33525
      richestuser
      Member

      Standard Value bet is in between 1/2-2/3 rd of pot…
      less than that is a (please call me bet)
      opponent had put u exactly on AJ..AQ ..AK hand….(because of preflop raise)
      with 8 BB deep this kind of play is rare to c in small buy-in tourneys…. anyways worked well for him

    • #33527

      Jagdeep- Lots of aces. Read what I wrote about your assumptions. Just because you wouldn’t play a hand in a certain way doesn’t mean morons in $5 tourneys will play the exact same way. If you think anyone in a $5 tourney has the discipline to fold AQ/AK/AJ or any ace for that matter, you need to play a lot more of these.

      You are assuming that anyone who plays the $5 tourney is a moron… And I never said that he will fold AQ/AK/AJ. I said AJ will pay you off and AQ and AK wil not play the hand this way.

    • #33529

      Jagdeep you are missing the point entirely. 95% of players in a $5 tournament ARE morons and will pay you off with all kinds of junk when they shouldn’t. This is why these tourneys are so profitable and this is just a fact that there’s no getting around.

      Also, the larger thing you don’t seem to understand is that just because you wouldn’t flat AQ or AK is not relevant. There are many players who will. Moreover very few players in a $5 tourney will fold an Ace here.

    • #33538
      Arjun Parmar
      Member

      lol… i have just mentioned what i would have done… no matter how deep i would have folded pre in MP 2… may be played it in CO or Button…

    • #33565

      ^^^ +1. shove now. he might be betting some x10 for all we know. if he has a set or a10 (which I doubt because the river bet looks too thin)
      then gg and move to another one.

    • #33591
      Denny
      Member

      Join DateOct 2010Posts173
      Responses

      Not sure why JagDeep is getting so much grief .. his conclusion is spot on however he arrived at it.

      Any re-shove on the river is a terrible play no matter how you window dress your analysis …

      a) No you have no information/history to suggest he is a moron (the fact that he has survived to this level would indicate otherwise) nor do you have information as to how he perceives your play.

      b) You have no information on what he would flat with .. so 77, 33, TT or suited 10 7 are all still potential hands but more likely a suited ace ..

      c) Not c-betting the flop is a major mistake as 1. You could have taken the pot down there and then 2. You would have gained more information .. but I suspect you were scared of him repopping you .. which is a possibility.

      d) A short stack is not risking his chips when he can check and take yet another free card.
      which makes checking the flop then calling that particular turn card a bad play also. You gave up the lead and control on the flop and are now simply calling to hit your card .. which as it turns out has landed you in trouble. If you have committed yourself to 7 5 suited .. then you should have played the hand stronger as soon as the flop landed. .. you had control (decisions should be made with every piece of information available to you .. not just your idea of perceived ranges for playing .. every player has a different playbook and operandus modi so you need to know your opponents play, what is he capable of flatting with, does he bluff c-bet, does he check back strong hands .. what is is my table image … too many variables0

      e) As for the opponent in the small blind with A 3 that is relatively decent flop given the preflop raise, I would have led out to see what sort of response it received .. it is not a great flop for either hand to have hit.

      But as it played out .. calling is the most sensible option since your hand is way short of the nuts or even 2nd nuts and anything else is gambling in this spot so Jag is correct in his conclusion. Why would you risk more chips when it is most likely not going to be paid off. (unless he is a moron/calling station .. and you do not have that information to hand to include it in any analysis)

    • #25737
      Denny
      Member

      lol… i have just mentioned what i would have done… no matter how deep i would have folded pre in MP 2… may be played it in CO or Button…

      Agreed MP2 is terrible, though depending on table dynamics I have even played hands like this from UTG especially if I m perceived as tight and it’sa very passive table .. you are only being called or reraised by strong hands.

      However since there is a strong possibility of being re-raised you are simply throwing away your chips .. Folding preflop is still a sensible option from MP2 .. no matter what level you play at.

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