AQ.. flop top 2, turn completes flush, river completes gutshot

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    • #26120

      Poker Stars $4.00+$0.40 No Limit Hold’em Tournament – t75/t150 Blinds + t20 – 8 players
      DeucesCracked Poker Videos Hand History Converter

      MP2: t6936 M = 18.02
      CO: t5361 M = 13.92
      BTN: t10556 M = 27.42
      SB: t8704 M = 22.61
      BB: t3466 M = 9.00
      Hero (UTG): t5103 M = 13.25
      UTG+1: t7245 M = 18.82
      MP1: t4937 M = 12.82

      Pre Flop: (t385) Hero is UTG with A Q
      Hero raises to t307, , CO calls t307, , SB calls t232,

      Flop: (t1231) A Q 4 (3 players)
      SB checks, Hero bets t467, CO calls t467, SB folds

      Turn: (t2165) 3 (2 players)
      Hero checks, CO checks

      River: (t2165) T (2 players)
      Hero bets t822, CO raises to t4567 all in, Hero ??

      think flush would have bet the turn..
      gutter ball (KJ) gets there..
      villain is 43/4 over 28 hands..
      thoughts and action?

    • #34453

      I think too he would have bet on turn with a flush. Too many weaker hands that would make the same move imo. ez call on river especially with those stats.

    • #34454
      Vinod KK

      Based on flop…
      likely Range: Ax, flush, KJ, Qx

      Based on Check.Check on turn
      Opponent range would not change in my opinion as he might decide to mask his flush.

      On the river i would have just checked. As betting is not going to give you any value as I do not see Ax or Qx calling(rest of the range will beat u). But a good player will exploit your check on turn adn could shove with Ax. So just check and call is my opinion as you pay less against the same range and you can win against Ax or Qx.

      But if you think the player is not capable of exploiting you turn check I would suggest fold.

    • #34455

      Is that your range for someone who have 43/4 stats..?

    • #34456
      Vinod KK

      Sorry i am not too familiar with online stats… It would be helpful if you explain and then i might rethink about it..

    • #34457

      43/4 means he is putting money in to 43% of the hands played pre, and he is raising 4% of the hands pre. loose passive player, his calling range here will be very wide.. Ofc we need a decent amount of hands to get the right stats, but I think 28 hands gives you a hunch of his tendencies.

    • #34458

      I am a noob, and I would have called this river, that’s what I do whole day. Call rivers, see that I am beat and blame it on the river.

      I am really interested to see how you handled this situation? 28 Hands does seem a bit less to jump to conclusion. $4.40 many fish players who think AK rocks even after all 5 cards are dealt and might shove on you, simply because of turn check.

      Some questions that I have on the turn check!

      Why did you check it?
      1. To see if your player has Flush, and bets you.
      2. You wanted him in hand? Disguise your top 2?
      3. If he would have bet the turn, what would you have done? Raise? Fold? Call?

      I am new to discussing hands, so please bear with me.

    • #34459
      Vinod KK

      Looks like player who likes to see flops cheap….in this case i would have bet the turn…… if he calls…….. check the river and fold to any bet coz i dont believe a loose player will wait till river to bet/exploit with Ax or any of the other hands that are weak…he will more likely check back on river with that scary board…

      As played its a fold to me on the river for the shove…loose passive player is not playing Ax or any of the other weaker hands that we beat on the river like that.

    • #34460
      Aditya Sushant

      Wat’re u doing betting 1/3rd pot in a 3 way pot on that wet a board? Also, bet turn. 43/4 types usually dont bluff so think ur beat which is why u’ve obviously posted this. Not sure if I would find a fold tho in real time and dont think I’d have played it this way

    • #34461

      way too many hands to which i can loose… i would definitely bet the turn…its better to loose small and get some info rather loosing big by checking..
      way hand played i will fold here…i still have 3700 chips which i can make use and find better spot to double up….rather than ending my tournament life with top 2 pair….
      their are like 15+ hands to which u can loose…so fold here…

    • #34462

      Checking turn is super bad here. You have Top Two against a passive uberfish and u bet tiny flop and check turn??!! Do you not like value? (We are betting for VALUE and not betting for info which is obv retarded). Is nothing except the stone cold nuts good enough for you to bet for value?

      Bet river is obv correct and bet a lot more FWIW.

      I have a feeling you are beat by some random gunk which got here, but this is a joker who can prolly shove worse two pairs etc for value and random retarded stuff for no reason at all, esp given how bizzare you’ve played. I’d prolly click the call button because I don’t fold to idiots like this and generally tourney life over-rated etc. Think river is close enough that it doesn’t matter much either way.

    • #34464

      agree, flop bet size was really bad .. (clicking std buttons)
      def did think about betting turn.. but none of the options (b/f or b/c) if got raised were appetizing .. thus elected to x/c

    • #34465

      agree, flop bet size was really bad .. (clicking std buttons)
      def did think about betting turn.. but none of the options (b/f or b/c) if got raised were appetizing .. thus elected to x/c

      Vinay this is just silly. The whole point is he raises very very infrequently and calls with worse a lot. Please stop rationalizing your fear -based decisions and pretending they make sense. This is just just very very poor and there is no way around it. You CANNOT make it in poker if your only methodology in this game is to wait for the nuts and use pot control lines every time you don’t have them (even though value bets are clearly called for)/

      Do you not remember the part where we are taught that not taking the best line because we are afraid of making a decision at some future point is stupid?

    • #34466
      Arjun Parmar

      yo vinay pre raise a bit small imo should make it around 400 that should be good imo. also on the flop again ur bet was small not even 50% of the pot, bet big on the flop yo, also bet on the turn checking the turn not good. i think ur check on the turn make it difficult for the river decision again the bet on the river was small imo.

    • #34469

      @prabhat .. yeah ok.. but planning ahead is also valid right .. so in this case if we get raised on turn .. our action?

      (I got conflicted thinking ahead here)

    • #34473

      If you think he is a weak player who raises only monsters then you can fold if you are very confident of that read.

      If you think he can be raising worse or he is just a clown in general, snap-call and fistpump.

      The broader point is not betting here because you don’t want to make this decision or you are scared of being raised when you have a strong, but non-nut hand is basically the same as raising for information- you are making suboptimal decisions because you are scared to play poker.

      I personally might puke-fold if I got raised and I was totally confident he had flushes only etc; against most guys, I’d get it and be happy.

      Don’t spend too much time thinking about this scenario though. It’s not happening more than 10% of the time anyway.

    • #26121

      thanks for your views guys; result: I called; villain had KJo

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